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  • I am late to the discussion in the original thread, so here is a new one.

    This wiki should go back to the localizations.  I will outline my reasons why.

    -This wiki is primarily in English, so it should follow this rule by using the English terminology.  Using the Japanese transliterations is very confusing, especially to those only familiar with the English terms.  If it were in Japanese, the Japanese terms would be more appropriate, but it is not.  Sticking with one language and the terms it uses is better for consistency and just common sense--you wouldn't randomly throw Mandarin sentences or transliterations into a passage about various Mandarin-originated subjects, for example.

    -Many of the transliterations are awkward or grammatically improper in English.  "World Void Information Controlling Organization" sounds horrible, no matter how you slice it.  "Novus Orbus Librarium" at least actually sounds like a proper organization name, despite the change to Latin.  "Combustible Witch" and "Magical Association" are other examples of names that work perfect in their mother language, but when transliterated into English sound confusing, awkward, or give the wrong idea (what is an 'ss-class rebel' after all?  'SS-class criminal' is much more clear.  "Mage's Guild" and "Magic Guild" are far more clear than "Magic Association" or "Magical Association.")

    -Night Vision's reasoning is purely subjective; opinion should NEVER dictate why you make a change in an encyclopedia-type website.  Regardless of whether or not you think the changes are 'bad' or 'absurd' they are nonetheless the terms used in our version, and work better for our language/majority of consumers.  Exceptions of course being in situations like where 'Bystander' and 'Observer' are condensed into one, but a simple note on the pages would fix this.

    -All other wikis dedicated to Japanese media stick with translated terms, unless there is a very strong reason for the exception (example being Phoenix Wright's wiki where Japanese names are used in unreleased media-centric pages).  As mentioned, this is because it is an English database--the terms should be consistent.

    -Some of the changes mentioned are wrong in Night Vision's original post.  Example: the claim that Azure Flame Grimoire is an incorrect translation because it isn't a 'grimoire.'  The original name, 'Book of the Blue Blaze' is also incorrect by this logic: as both translations make it clear that the Azure Grimoire is not a phyisical book in any form, and this is simply its name however misleading it might be.

    -Using transliterations leads to a slippery slope that opens the door to shifting to a wiki filled with broken English in an attempt to reconcile the differences.  Examples could be using pure translations of the character's names (Raguna as opposed to Ragna or Meioh Izanami as opposed to Hades: Izanami) or simply posting literal translations of character dialogue on the quote pages (example: instead of Susanoo's English translation for '暮れてやるよ吸血鬼…絶対なる神の力を!' being properly translated to 'I'm going to end you, vampire… with absolute divine punishment! ', somebody would find the hard translation of "I'll be at dusk Vampire ... Absolutely power of God!" to be acceptable, or even worse: 'Kurete yaru yo kyūketsuki… zettai naru kami no chikara o!')


    In short, the shift to translation was a horrible idea, and simply makes the wiki look disorganized, confusing, and much worse than before.  It also reflects a bit poorly on the community as well.  I hope to see a reversion back to the previous standard---I would be happy to contribute to reverting it all as well.  Because as it stands, this was not a good idea.

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    • Frankly, I don't even care anymore.

      Night, I still think translations are better and would rather keep them, but people demand their localization!

      So, please, change every term to its localized version. Change Bystanders into Observers, change XBlaze vigilantes into bounty hunters, change Hazama's Blue Grimoire into Azure Grimoire, change both magic and sorcery into magic, change Prime Fields into Contingency Mediums, change Clavis Alucard into Relius Clover, change Amanohokosaka into Amano Hokozaka, change Sister into nuns, change Tenjo's and Homura's genders into male, change Event Interference into casual distortion...

      This is what people want! Trying to give them the correct terms was not a good idea, you see.

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    • You know, I really do not see the need to be sarcastic or standoffish.  I actually was rather cordial and gave my reasons and wrote out my points in hopes it wouldn't just be seen as 'muh preferences' but instead as a chance to see legitimate arguments for the previous.  But apparently mockery and acting like I rolled on up and demanded you change it or else I'd threaten to burn your house down, instead of trying to be professional is the way things go about here.  Oh, and original transliterations as being 'correct terms' is the type of logic I'd expect from one of those people who believes that any change to the original Japanese of anything is inferior and that Japan > anything else, but not from a wiki moderator.

      I even mentioned a point about Bystanders and Observers, but it seems in your haste to just start throwing mud you overlooked it.  Really classy.

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    • IT WAS EXPLAINED SO MANY TIMES AT THE BEGINNING OF THIS CHANGE. But okay, let's repeat it!

      • This wiki is primarily in English, so it should follow this rule by using the English terminology.

      And it uses proper English terminology translated from the original source.

      • Using the Japanese transliterations is very confusing, especially to those only familiar with the English terms. If it were in Japanese, the Japanese terms would be more appropriate, but it is not.

      Do you know what transliteration is? Because I can't see anywhere on this wiki calling Grimoire as Madōsho.

      • Sticking with one language and the terms it uses is better for consistency and just common sense--you wouldn't randomly throw Mandarin sentences or transliterations into a passage about various Mandarin-originated subjects, for example.

      And again, where do we do this? In cases like "Sankishin", "Amaterasu", etc. it just has to be like this.

      • Many of the transliterations are awkward or grammatically improper in English. "World Void Information Controlling Organization" sounds horrible, no matter how you slice it.

      No matter how I slice it, Japanese people called it like this.

      • "Novus Orbus Librarium" at least actually sounds like a proper organization name, despite the change to Latin.

      Sounds, but when we translate this name, it's a nonsense, because: "Hey, let's call it a 'New World Library', but we hate being called as the 'Library'!"

      • "Combustible Witch" and "Magical Association" are other examples of names that work perfect in their mother language, but when transliterated into English sound confusing, awkward, or give the wrong idea

      And again, it's not transliteration. 爆炎 turned into "combustible", but when I think about it "Blazing" may fit better here.

      • "Mage's Guild" and "Magic Guild" are far more clear than "Magic Association" or "Magical Association."

      I can't see a problem with calling it as "Magic(al) Association", especially when definition of "association" word fits here much more than for "guild".

      • what is an 'ss-class rebel' after all? 'SS-class criminal' is much more clear.

      And the game has rebels and criminals, so let's just merge it into "criminal", because it's "more clear", even when it's a title for people who REBELED against the Controlling Organization. Even the page explains it.

      • Night Vision's reasoning is purely subjective; opinion should NEVER dictate why you make a change in an encyclopedia-type website.

      Purely subjective, because the fact I can have an opinion is bad, yes?

      • Regardless of whether or not you think the changes are 'bad' or 'absurd' they are nonetheless the terms used in our version, and work better for our language/majority of consumers.

      Good, then I think everyone will be fine when I'm going to start call Prime Fields once as Boundary Interface Prime Field Device (ooh, this name makes so much sense!), then as Dimensional Boundary Contact Prime Field Force, and then as Dimensional Boundary Interface Link, and who knows what else, because they are terms used in our version. Hopefully then nobody will feel lost or something.

      • Exceptions of course being in situations like where 'Bystander' and 'Observer' are condensed into one, but a simple note on the pages would fix this.

      It is called cherry picking. Change everything, or nothing.

      • All other wikis dedicated to Japanese media stick with translated terms, unless there is a very strong reason for the exception (example being Phoenix Wright's wiki where Japanese names are used in unreleased media-centric pages). As mentioned, this is because it is an English database--the terms should be consistent.

      And what? I'm just reminding we asked people if they want translations or localizations, and they choose translations

      • Some of the changes mentioned are wrong in Night Vision's original post. Example: the claim that Azure Flame Grimoire is an incorrect translation because it isn't a 'grimoire.' The original name, 'Book of the Blue Blaze' is also incorrect by this logic: as both translations make it clear that the Azure Grimoire is not a phyisical book in any form, and this is simply its name however misleading it might be.

      What. No seriously, what? So yeah let's say it's a grimoire (magic book) because *I* feel so and it makes for *me* more sense, screw Mori and the fact he called it (not a magic) book.

      • -Using transliterations leads to a slippery slope that opens the door to shifting to a wiki filled with broken English in an attempt to reconcile the differences. Examples could be using pure translations of the character's names (Raguna as opposed to Ragna or Meioh Izanami as opposed to Hades: Izanami)

      Again: what are you talking about? Nobody uses here transliteration, you can't see here awesome articles in style: "SS-kyuu no hangyakusha is the highest rebel class and one of them is Raguna za Buraddoejji".

      • or simply posting literal translations of character dialogue on the quote pages (example: instead of Susanoo's English translation for '暮れてやるよ吸血鬼…絶対なる神の力を!' being properly translated to 'I'm going to end you, vampire… with absolute divine punishment! ', somebody would find the hard translation of "I'll be at dusk Vampire ... Absolutely power of God!" to be acceptable, or even worse: 'Kurete yaru yo kyūketsuki… zettai naru kami no chikara o!')

      And I still don't know what's the point of saying this. This page has a proper translation just as you said. If someone's going to replace this translation with Google Translate like gibberish, then don't expect that I'm going to accept it.

      • In short, the shift to translation was a horrible idea, and simply makes the wiki look disorganized, confusing, and much worse than before. It also reflects a bit poorly on the community as well.
      • I hope to see a reversion back to the previous standard---I would be happy to contribute to reverting it all as well. Because as it stands, this was not a good idea.

      Nothing's gonna change, it was decision of at least semi-active users. And even if by some chance we decided to change it back, then I wouldn't need anyone's help, when I have AutoWikiBrowser to change stuff.

      And Homura and Tenjou are not males, localization made it up.

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    • Kouzen wrote: You know, I really do not see the need to be sarcastic or standoffish.  I actually was rather cordial and gave my reasons and wrote out my points in hopes it wouldn't just be seen as 'muh preferences' but instead as a chance to see legitimate arguments for the previous.  But apparently mockery and acting like I rolled on up and demanded you change it or else I'd threaten to burn your house down, instead of trying to be professional is the way things go about here.  Oh, and original transliterations as being 'correct terms' is the type of logic I'd expect from one of those people who believes that any change to the original Japanese of anything is inferior and that Japan > anything else, but not from a wiki moderator.

      I even mentioned a point about Bystanders and Observers, but it seems in your haste to just start throwing mud you overlooked it.  Really classy.

      I'm not being sarcastic, this is not mockery. But a respond like this is definitely something I expect from people who use incorrect terms (transliteration is a different thing, y'know) to act smart.

      I actually want Night to change everything into how it was localized to make you, and people like you, understand how f@cked up the localization is.

      Yes, you mentioned a point about Bystanders and Observers. But then someone else comes and is like "I haven't seen any of those Bystanders in the game, change them to Observers". Better safe than sorry, we should revert everything.

      Oh, and if you seriously think that terms from the original, Japanese, version are not correct then nothing in the games is correct, because it comes from the Japanese version!

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    • Your main points are

      • Everyone is used to localization - we talked about it in no less than three threads. Result? Translations are staying.
      • We have bad translations - then suggest a better one, instead of telling us to switch to the localization that is even worse.
      • We might end up writing everything in Japanese here - if it worked that way, I wouldn't have to save money to take Japanese courses. Think a bit before saying stuff like that, it seems like you just made up a point because you felt you don't have enough to convince us.
      • Translations look weird - and your suggestion is to use made up stuff because it's less weird.

      And my favourite

      the claim that Azure Flame Grimoire is an incorrect translation because it isn't a 'grimoire.' The original name, 'Book of the Blue Blaze' is also incorrect by this logic: as both translations make it clear that the Azure Grimoire is not a phyisical book in any form, and this is simply its name however misleading it might be.

      Except this thing is not an Azure Grimoire. Grimoire is a term that defines an item that converts magical element (seithr) into power. This thing is not a Grimoire, it does not convert anything. It is called a book despite not being a book, but it was never called a Grimoire, except in localization. Azure Flamed Grimoire is incorrect because that thing does not fit the definition of a Grimoire. Understand?

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    • If it was explained so clearly, providing a link to it on the front page would make it a lot easier for newer users and/or the uninformed.  Even the original thread for this barely felt like it explained anything. I really see no actual reason for so much hostility.

      Nonetheless:

      "And it uses proper English terminology translated from the original source."

      Hard translations/unofficial translations of the original Japanese are not the proper English terminology.  Whatever the translations from the official dubbed version are, are the proper English terminology.  Always over whatever you literally translate from the original Japanese. It has always been this way in all official and unofficial channels for literally any media from Japan.  If you truly wanted proper English terminology, go with the English translations.

      "Do you know what transliteration is? Because I can't see anywhere on this wiki calling Grimoire as Madōsho."

      Sorry, I mixed up 'transliteration' with something else, so that was indeed an error on my part.  That being said, the example you listed does not occur here, No, there are other examples where it's not too far from this.  The NOL name translated from the Japanese form is an example of this, and while you might not have written it directly as "Sekai Kokū Jōhō Tōsei Kikō" the hard translation is in itself ajust as bad.  At that point, you might as well just start writing Madōsho or whatever for everything if you're that intent on going with the original.

      "And again, where do we do this? In cases like "Sankishin", "Amaterasu", etc. it just has to be like this."

      Surely you can't be serious about using Amaterasu as an example here.  That's a name directly from Japanese mythology; it's far different than something like Sankishin.  But to answer this question, Amaterasu and Sankishin would be fine here because that's what the English script uses.  Using Blue instead of Azure or Shinki: Murakumo instead of Lux Sanctus: Murakumo is incorrect, however, since those are not the official terms.  It's really not so complicated--just follow the English script.

      "No matter how I slice it, Japanese people called it like this."

      But this is not a wiki in Japanese, nor is it written in hard-translated Japanese.  So regardless of what it's called in Japanese/hard-translated to, that is not the correct term for an English wiki.

      "Sounds, but when we translate this name, it's a nonsense, because: "Hey, let's call it a 'New World Library', but we hate being called as the 'Library'!""

      Given how the first game has a Miss Litchi segment dedicated to why they have that name and why shortening it to the Library isn't something they approve of, it's not that ridiculous, and keeps with consistency as well. New World Library is also far more proper than...whatever you want to call World Void Information Controlling Organization.  That's just objectively improper English.

      "And again, it's not transliteration. 爆炎 turned into "combustible", but when I think about it "Blazing" may fit better here."

      Now this I like, because Blazing would be a better fit (I'm not advocating for it though since it's not the official chosen translation) and you're sort of seeing what I'm getting at here.  A direct translation or hard translation oftentimes doesn't translate well from any language to another.  Keep in mind that a translator's job is not simply just to translate the language as-is for foreign audiences, but make it understandable and to make the script seem more natural in their tongue.  That is why using the official English translations is best here--they may not be exactly the same as the original, but they fit the language itself better.  Plus, consistency AND them being official and all.

      "I can't see a problem with calling it as "Magic(al) Association", especially when definition of "association" word fits here much more than for "guild"."

      Association, perhaps, but what does 'magical' imply?  It's very ambiguous and open-ended.  Mage's Guild narrows it down and makes it easier for you to infer, even if 'guild' isn't exactly the most proper conveyance.  And again, it's the official translation.

      "And the game has rebels and criminals, so let's just merge it into "criminal", because it's "more clear", even when it's a title for people who REBELED against the Controlling Organization. Even the page explains it."

      Kokonoe is an SS-Class Criminal who isn't actively rebelling--she is labeled because of her philosophy and development of dangerous weapons and aiding terrorists.  'Criminal' fits her far better, and is likely why they went with it as the term.  I really hate to keep saying it, but again, it's what the official translators went with.

      Also I'm sorry, but I really cannot help but shake my head when I see 'rebelled against the Controlling Organization.'  It just sounds like a line from a poorly-written novel or something, and how out of place it feels is likely why they changed it.

      "Purely subjective, because the fact I can have an opinion is bad, yes? "

      You're misunderstanding what I'm saying.  There is nothing wrong with having an opinion that is critical of official translations; having differing ideas and thoughts is very good for discussion, as well!!  But one's opinion should never factor into whether or not official terminology is used on a site such as this.  I'm not saying you're wrong if you were to use the literal translations because you like them more in informal discussion like this, but a site that is intending to be an encyclopedia for the series while using a language that isn't its original one shouldn't mix and match terms purely because the admins like one better than the other.

      "Good, then I think everyone will be fine when I'm going to start call Prime Fields once as Boundary Interface Prime Field Device (ooh, this name makes so much sense!), then as Dimensional Boundary Contact Prime Field Force, and then as Dimensional Boundary Interface Link, and who knows what else, because they are terms used in our version. Hopefully then nobody will feel lost or something."

      Your pointed sarcasm is noted, but actually, yes, it would help greatly in people not being as lost.  This wiki is not solely for people already familiar with or having in-depth knowledge of the series--many wiki users go to a respective thing's wiki to learn more about the subject or study up on it without any prior knowledge.  I really don't see why you're so prickly about suggesting that using official terms that this audience (and even the ones who know the series in-depth) are more familiar with is such a horrendous thought.

      "It is called cherry picking. Change everything, or nothing."

      That's...not how cherry picking works.  Furthermore, I wasn't saying only change Bystander and Observer, but simply include notes on the pages to differentiate between the two different types of Observers.

      "And what? I'm just reminding we asked people if they want translations or localizations, and they choose translations"

      To be fair, only a very small amount of people even posted feedback, and the one who did say they were against it got shot down and booed--can you blame them for not elaborating on why they didn't like it with that hostility?  Also, locking the thread discourages anybody else from bringing it up who might have good points to raise or who could show the discussion in another way.  I would've gladly posted this there instead of making a brand new thing about it if I could.

      "What. No seriously, what? So yeah let's say it's a grimoire (magic book) because *I* feel so and it makes for *me* more sense, screw Mori and the fact he called it (not a magic) book."

      You're either willfully misinterpreting what I'm saying or didn't get what I tried to say, but what I meant is you pointed out that Azure Flame Grimoire seemed to imply it HAD to be a magic book.  It doesn't--it's just a stylistic name choice, and keeps consistency with the rest of the tone they had.  It doesn't change anything about the original meaning.

      "Again: what are you talking about? Nobody uses here transliteration, you can't see here awesome articles in style: "SS-kyuu no hangyakusha is the highest rebel class and one of them is Raguna za Buraddoejji"."

      "And I still don't know what's the point of saying this. This page has a proper translation just as you said. If someone's going to replace this translation with Google Translate like gibberish, then don't expect that I'm going to accept it."

      That is not what I said.  I said that having the wiki as it is now opens up the doors for it to possibly look like that, eventually.  That being said, your last sentence there is a relief to see, so I'll concede on this point at least that I'm wrong.

      "Nothing's gonna change, it was decision of at least semi-active users. And even if by some chance we decided to change it back, then I wouldn't need anyone's help, when I have AutoWikiBrowser to change stuff."

      That's good to hear that it's an easy enough change if you do decide it, but I wish you would at least consider that I'm not bringing all of this up because "I LIKE OFFICIAL TRANSLATIONS BETTER" or anything.  And while it may have been the decision of semi-active users, I will say that doesn't necessarily make it a correct one.  This is a site that is a knowledge database for English speakers to learn more about BlazBlue, and this includes not only diehard fans and wiki users but visitors and newcomers.  The change to translations may be preferred by some, but it ultimately causes some dissonance/isolation from the other side.

      "And Homura and Tenjou are not males, localization made it up."

      I don't recall ever mentioning them, and I'm not arguing that the localization made it up.  But that's also a vastly different situation than name translation choices, and I would definitely be against listing them as males on their pages if anybody said so--especially given we have a media outright showing Tenjo's true gender.

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    • "Everyone is used to localization - we talked about it in no less than three threads. Result? Translations are staying."

      That doesn't mean you should close off the discussion to those not present at the time or newcomers as well.  A wiki should be flexible and willing to make change--just as you did with localization to translation, you should allow the idea to eventually revert if it appears or somebody brings up good reason to do so.  And you should make those three threads far more visible, as I was only able to find one.  It'd also alleviate confusion to newcomers or people unfamiliar with the series.

      "We have bad translations - then suggest a better one, instead of telling us to switch to the localization that is even worse."

      I will not suggest a better translation, because you shouldn't be using your own translations to begin with.  An English speaking wiki should use the officially-chosen English terms for consistency.  And no, the entire localization is not 'even worse.'  I shudder to use the word, but that's a very 'weeaboo' line of thinking.  Though, I suppose you'll simply react angrily to the word of the use instead of considering why I would even say it.

      "We might end up writing everything in Japanese here - if it worked that way, I wouldn't have to save money to take Japanese courses. Think a bit before saying stuff like that, it seems like you just made up a point because you felt you don't have enough to convince us."

      I really get the feeling you're not even reading what I'm saying and just coming up with whatever you want to from my post.  Don't tell me to think before I say stuff when you can't even practice the same thing.  Let me spell it out for you:

      You are operating a wiki for a game produced in a language that is not the game's native one, for an audience that speaks that language and is more familiar with the localized terms.  Using the Japanese hard translations is just a mess and freezes out a certain audience of viewers and users.

      "Translations look weird - and your suggestion is to use made up stuff because it's less weird."

      Not all of it is 'made up.'  I will not deny that some are definitely creative liberties but for the most part the official script sticks close to it.  Furthermore, half of the original meanings are just as made-up anyways (what is a Prime Field Device outside of the game's context?  And clearly anybody would know what an Archenemy Weapon is, so Nox Nyctores is just offensive because it's 'made up.'  Are you serious?)

      "And my favourite"

      I really need to pick on this point.  You are a moderator.  Your job is to be professional and not act like an ass to your members, especially when I have done nothing but simply try to provide an alternate reason to the subject.  If you can't respond to somebody you disagree with who's been trying to provide another viewpoint in a manner that's expected of your position or cordially, then you shouldn't be a moderator.

      "Except this thing is not an Azure Grimoire. Grimoire is a term that defines an item that converts magical element (seithr) into power. This thing is not a Grimoire, it does not convert anything. It is called a book despite not being a book, but it was never called a Grimoire, except in localization. Azure Flamed Grimoire is incorrect because that thing does not fit the definition of a Grimoire. Understand?"

      Don't throw the 'understand?' at the end there; it just makes you look like self-congratulatory and needlessly smug.

      And like Night Vision you completely misunderstood what I was saying.  "Azure Flame Grimoire" is simply another naming choice that isn't literal, just like the actual Japanese translation.  It's less wordy and awkard-sounding than a hard translation, and though it may share 'grimoire' in its name with a separately named thing, the English script is still clear enough it's not one of them.  It's the official term, and it should be followed on an English-speaking encyclopedia site for the series--regardless of how you may feel about it.

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    • >You are a moderator. Your job is to be professional and not act like an ass to your members

      Except when I am nice, those members are acting "like an ass" to everyone else. That's a hard lesson the BlazBlue Fandom taught me: either you be "an ass" or the place you're running ends up vandalized.

      >then you shouldn't be a moderator

      You know what? You're totally right! Absolutely, 100% correct! I'm f@cking tired of people like you, of all the English Fandom, of Gamma Venom, and I don't want to deal with that anymore. I retire.

      >Don't throw the 'understand?' at the end there; it just makes you look like self-congratulatory and needlessly smug.

      You called an "Azure Flamed Grimoire" just an "Azure Grimoire" - that indicates you do not understand something. As we have a lot of autists and aspies here, I feel the need to ask people if they need a clearer explanation. But no, "you're a bad moderator and you should be ashamed" is the first thing everyone assumes.

      Night, change it. Give them back the localization. At least we two know how everything is supposed to be called, that's enough for me. Everyone else can assume whatever they want.

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    • "I'm not being sarcastic, this is not mockery. But a respond like this is definitely something I expect from people who use incorrect terms (transliteration is a different thing, y'know) to act smart."

      Very nice assumption.  I noted that I mixed up the term 'transliteration' with something else.  I wasn't using it to try and sound smart; it was an honest mistake on my part, and I rectified it.  The point I was making isn't lost because of one error like that, and you focusing on it to try and take away from that point says something.

      "I actually want Night to change everything into how it was localized to make you, and people like you, understand how f@cked up the localization is."

      The localization is not perfect, but it's not as fucked up as you're claiming.  It does the job a localization is supposed to do: take the original text, translate AND change it to be better suited for its foreign audience and their language, and deliver the game to them in a form that works for them.  Most of the translations are not as bad as you're pretending they are.

      Yes, you mentioned a point about Bystanders and Observers. But then someone else comes and is like "I haven't seen any of those Bystanders in the game, change them to Observers". Better safe than sorry, we should revert everything.

      I know you're being sarcastic, but you actually should.  That confusion you mentioned isn't just a joke or something to wave off.  If you're going to have this site be billed up as a wiki for BlazBlue in English, you need to actually do that--not treat it as just some random BlazBlue page on the internet.  This means working with the official terms and trying to erase confusion for all your audiences, and not simply cater to your own preferences.

      Oh, and if you seriously think that terms from the original, Japanese, version are not correct then nothing in the games is correct, because it comes from the Japanese version!

      Are you unable to read, or are you just putting words in my mouth to start fights and try to feel better about yourself? I'm saying you should use official translations from the version of the game in the language your site is--not your own unofficial, literal translation.  So yes, everything you've switched to IS wrong for this site because it's not from the version you're working with.

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    • "Except when I am nice, those members are acting "like an ass" to everyone else. That's a hard lesson the BlazBlue Fandom taught me: either you be "an ass" or the place you're running ends up vandalized."

      So lock the pages.  Just because you get vandals doesn't mean you abandon a professional or courteous attitude when dealing with people you disagree with who weren't trying to start a fight or anything.

      You know what? You're totally right! Absolutely, 100% correct! I'm f@cking tired of people like you, of all the English Fandom, of Gamma Venom, and I don't want to deal with that anymore. I retire.

      If you want to retire, that's your own decision, as is you being sarcastic instead of simply realizing 'hey this guy was just trying to bring up a few points and I attacked him just because I don't agree with it.'  I don't even know what Gamma Venom is, nor do I care.  If you don't want to deal with people posting stuff you may disagree with and then (rightfully) being annoyed when you wave them off or act this way, then maybe you shouldn't deal with it like you said.

      "You called an "Azure Flamed Grimoire" just an "Azure Grimoire" - that indicates you do not understand something. As we have a lot of autists and aspies here, I feel the need to ask people if they need a clearer explanation. But no, "you're a bad moderator and you should be ashamed" is the first thing everyone assumes."

      And not having known about the community situation, I'll apologize then for what I said--I was wrong and I appreciate that your intention wasn't to be rude or smarmy.

      Night, change it. Give them back the localization. At least we two know how everything is supposed to be called, that's enough for me. Everyone else can assume whatever they want.

      I'm not saying you can't enjoy a direct translation that's different from the official one, far from it!  I just really think that if you're going to have the wiki be in English, you should use the terms officially used in that version to avoid confusion.  I think having direct translations of the Japanese original text in parenthesis on the beginning of the page that's the current ones you have now does just as good of a job in showing visitors the Japanese names and direct translations.  Other wikis about anime or games from Japan do this and it works out splendidly.

      Alternatively, isn't it possible to set up alternate languages for the wiki?  Because you could set up a Japanese page as well to have a page that uses the original terms as well.

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    • I feel like I should say something but I have no idea what to say.

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    • Neither I do, because this discussion is basically like

      • It's an English community, so don't use translations when you have official localization (which was based on... the Japanese version, somehow)
      • English translations are bad because they are not official localization, and obviously localization is always right, always follow the English script (y'know, Mirror's Edge is a "defensive mechanism placed upon Relius Clover's coffin", Ishana is a city of magisters, Homura and Tenjou are males, etc.)
      • When you want to use translations it's bad, because you might just start writing stuff in Japanese (wtf?)
      • Rebels and criminals are the same, because rebel=criminal.
      • No difference between a (grimoire) and a regular book, why name it as the original calls it who cares if it was done on purpose to show some differences.
      • When you use translations instead of localization, then surely you're gonna accept some gibberish and probably even reject better translations.
      • Community decided, but then it's bad because I didn't give them a year to decide (but seriously, I could give them more time, but not like I would even get much more reactions)

      No, seriously, I don't even have power to repeat was has been told before and even to continue this discussion. All I want to say that I wouldn't even bother myself with changing localizations to translations -- because 4 hours sitting and looking at the program's window wasn't really nice -- if localization team stopped messing around. At least with these translations people writing articles here don't have to think: "hm, should I use the Library version -- 'Ars Armegis' -- or the more popular version -- 'Ars Armagus'?"

      I understand that you prefer official versions, but as I said before, it's hard to go with official versions mainly because of bad translations or/and multiple translations, and I'm really hoping that next Blue stories are going to get better localization than this, because this series is worth this.

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    • There's quite a few interesting points being made despite the palpable levels of animosity on this thread. Human sociology and the concept of righteousness and perceived correctness of ideas is funny.

      On the one hand, casual players/fans will likely not bother to invest in the original games and becoming fluent in Japanese and the Japanese's idea of what English is supposed to be, meaning that they're only being exposed to the localized terms (whatever their level of quality is, that's been debated enough here.)

      More... "invested" fans would probably appreciate the use of translations of the original Japanese terms moreso than what they (evidently) perceive to be lackluster translations, because they're willing to hunt for that extra bit of meaning or truth that could be found from those terms that was lost in translation by the localization (which is a strange yet also intriguing train of thought, because Japanese is a language which has many awkward results when attempting an exact translation).

      I prefer to join our Administrator Night Vision's relatively neutral stand on this, as both sides seem to be waving their postions' respective flags pretty strongly to the point that it's hard to want to fully support either one.

      That being said, I must give my two cents, as I feel that the ramifications on whether to be a decisively localization or translation based website will ultimately dictate the BlazBlue wiki's future, and either this wiki will turn off newer fans to the series who will get lost navigating this site, or the veterans will be disgusted by the concept of catering to the whims of the localization company and leave.

      On any wiki, these kinds of toxic edit wars beg the question as to whether some members have started to convince themselves that they own the entire flow of information from a widely recognized and beloved franchise, when in fact none of us really own this franchise, we just love it.

      In short, please treat each other with respect and be adults. Do not make accusations of character towards wiki staff or demands for their resignation, and please don't turn your ire on the community by name-calling them autistic or retarded or such. Be better than those who only feel self-worth by trolling others and picking fights

      Please continue to take good care of the BlazBlue wiki

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    • This appears to be a rather decisive topic doesn't it...

      While I originally thought that localisation should have priority, I do appreciate it's more logical to separate things back how they were meant to (e.g. magic/sorcery) and then retroactively say that they were localised as being the same etc. While it's harder for people with only [surface] knowledge from the localisation, I think it's pretty hard to really get into the nitty-gritty and interesting things without understanding the original material (which like the light novels etc. tends to be Japanese only and so may rely on things that were 'broken' by the localisation to make sense).

      It's also interesting to see how everything is phrased in Japanese (although the Library's full name is still a mouthful and a half to say in Japanese lol).

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    • A FANDOM user
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